'Ard Boyz Birmingham, AL (again)

Battles and discussion of tactics from the earliest days of our Academy.
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Iron-Fist
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'Ard Boyz Birmingham, AL (again)

Post#1 » Aug 17 2011 12:13

So, my 4th 'Ard Boyz, and I've decided I can friggin do it with Tau. In 4th ed I had a single 1750 list that I played against all my friend's armies and literally never lost, and I loved it. I love the idea of an Take All Comers list, and I struggled to design one for the 'Ard Boyz point level, in 5th edition, with all the new codices out there.

Here's what I went with:

HQ
-Shas'el (PR+MP+TA+HW MT+HW DC)
--2x Shield Drones
-2x Crisis BG (PR+MP+TA+HW MT)
--1x Gun Drone (HW DC on one)

-Shas'el (PR+MP+TA+HW MT+HW DC)
--2x Shield Drones
-2x Crisis BG (PR+MP+TA+HW MT)
--1x Gun Drone (HW DC on one)

Elite
-Shas'ui TL (PR+MP+TA+HW MT+HW DC)
--2x Shield Drones
-2x Crisis (PR+MP+TA+MT)

-Shas'ui TL (PR+MP+TA+HW MT+HW DC)
--2x Shield Drones
-2x Crisis (PR+MP+TA+MT)

Troops
-6x Firewarriors (rifles)
-6x Firewarriors (rifles)
-10x Kroot
-10x Kroot
-10x Kroot

Fast Attack
-4x Pathfinders
--Devilfish (DP)

-4x Pathfinders
--Devilfish (DP)

Heavy Support
-Broadside TL (TA+HW TL+HW DC)
--2x Shield Drones
-2x Broadside (TA)

-Broadside TL (ASS+HW TL+HW DC)
--2x Shield Drones
-2x Broadside (ASS)

-Broadside TL (ASS+HW TL+HW DC)
--2x Shield Drones
-2x Broadside (ASS)

Basically, I'm terrified of lots of FNP jump marines and GK terminators, so I brought 12x fireknives, as well protected with drones as possible. The only really efficient anti-armor Tau have are broadsides, so I maxed out on them, again with drones. One of the missions was objective based, so I brought two tough scoring units (FW in pathfinder fish) and 3 squishier, but more utilitarian ones. I felt like a fool for not using all my elite slots, but I'd have to drop a broadside and a kroot squad to get my flamer Deathrains, and I just didn't feel like I could. I was hoping that SMS, kroot rifles, and concentrated missile would be enough for me to beat hordes, turns out I was dead wrong.

On the way to the tournament, I'm talking to my GF about how terribly I will suffer vs specifically horde orks. Self fulfilling, apparently.

Game 1:
First turn night fight, pitched battle, kill points vs Scott's horde Orks

His list:
Ghazzy
Mad Dok
4x Mega Nobs in a wagon with mad dok
9x Mega Nobs with Ghazzy in a kitted out Battle wagon
5x30 Boyz with rokkits and claw nob

Synopsis:
Well, I'm against my nemesis. Scott is maybe the BEST ork player I've ever seen, he is super efficient with his movement (lines, just move the front 4 unique models and replace from the back), and his army has like zero kill points. I win first turn, spread over the board nice and evenly, thinking I'll maneuver to one side and try to sweep around. Kroot are deployed slightly forward to absorb the initial assaults. Well, he seizes and 1st turn assaults them with Ghazzy's wagon of duders, 2 kill points to him. I try to manuever away from him with suits, but he catches one of the elites during his waaagh turn. Broadside SMS and all my missiles kill the 2 units on one side and do succeed to sweep up there, but he catches all the 'sides, kills the fish while they try to block for things, gets all the kroot, and it ends up a major loss (although just BARELY).

Game 2:
Objectives this time vs.... more Ghazzy/mad dok horde orks. DAMNIT!

His list:
Ghazzy
Mad Dok
15x Lootas
5x Kommandos w/ Snikrot (go with Mad Dok)
4x mega nobs in trukk (go with ghazzy)
4x30 Boyz with extras
3x3 Killa Kans

Synopsis:
I kill the Kans super fast, kill one squad of boyz, spend 2 turns of shooting for 3 crisis teams killing mad dok and his 5 dudes (ridic cover and FNP saves). He kills almost nothing (mad dok got a kroot squad when he came in, then got side tracked by devilfish drones) but still wins a massacre because I can't kill anywhere near enough orks.

Game 3
Victory points DOW vs Deathwing

List:
Belial
5x units of termis, most with assault cannons
3x landraiders

Synopsis:
I give him first, have everything come into a nice open area, he deepstrikes into me 2-3 squads at a time and I kill everything as it comes in. He gets 127 victory points, I get 1850. Massacre for me, yay.

Thoughts:
Okay, so I got some pretty bad luck playing the only two ork players there (everyone else was mech IG or some sort of marine). I looked at armies on other tables and wept softly thinking while my fireknives plinked away at orks in cover. But I literally couldnt do ANYTHING to these guys. Broadside SMS was awesome, but just not enough. Part of me wants to switch 6 broadsides to Railheads, maybe add in piranha to shore up anti AV 13/14, but they are just so unreliable. WTF do I do to make a TAC list these days? Have the extremes shifted so much that I simply can't deal with mech/mass meq and hordes? It makes me so frustrated.
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Blueshock
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Re: 'Ard Boyz Birmingham, AL (again)

Post#2 » Aug 17 2011 12:17

Iron-Fist wrote:Part of me wants to switch 6 broadsides to Railheads.


I hear you bro...that many FK's you probably should have used Hammers. Sorry to hear. Way to stick in there though.
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TheAmbit
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Re: 'Ard Boyz Birmingham, AL (again)

Post#3 » Aug 17 2011 12:24

As a former ork horde player, you honestly wouldn't have done any better with 3 railheads on the boys. You'd have killed more but it wouldn't have really changed the tide of the battle unless your table has zero cover and he didn't take a bigmek. I think you were just the rock to his paper in those games though had you paired against more of the newer armies you'd likely have done a bit better.

Luck of the draw.

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Iron-Fist
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Re: 'Ard Boyz Birmingham, AL (again)

Post#4 » Aug 17 2011 12:54

@commander blueshock
Yeah, I'm just always worried about multiple landraider armies (there was 1 with 3 and 3 more with 2), and fusion piranha never seem to get the job done =/

@Theambit
Yeah, that's pretty much my final conclusion. Those templates are sweet when combined with some marker lights (and the added burst cannon shots are nice too), but man sometimes its just not enough. I think the flamer Deathrains would have been nice to have, just to finish off those last 8-10 orks in cover. Really though, horde orks are just bloody brutal vs Tau who are trying to be TAC. Too few KP for those missions, too many ridiculously tough scoring units for the rest.

I hope Farsight gets a nice boost in the new codex, all I need is one single unit that can assault something...
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Re: 'Ard Boyz Birmingham, AL (again)

Post#5 » Aug 17 2011 01:20

A lot of your problems were probably caused by your lack of blocking units. A unit or three of blocking Piranhas and aggressive use of empty Devilfish would have been a lot better at buying time for your shooting units than the Kroot. Orks are great at removing units like Kroot, but are terrible at killing fast vehicles. Move a Piranha squadron flat out into the path of an Ork unit, and it's quite likely that the Orks will be unable to do anything but flail uselessly at it next turn. And if you're really concerned about horde armies, flechettes on your blocking units will kill half an Ork squad (on average) every time they attempt to kill a Piranha or Devilfish.

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Re: 'Ard Boyz Birmingham, AL (again)

Post#6 » Aug 17 2011 01:36

I used to bring piranha, but it always comes down to them being soooo expensive for what you get. Still, you may be right. 255 pts for 3x TA/DP/FB/FL piranha might have made the difference in that game, for sure, although I'm not really sure what I would take out for them...
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Re: 'Ard Boyz Birmingham, AL (again)

Post#7 » Aug 17 2011 04:06

Elite
-Shas'ui TL (PR+MP+TA+HW MT+HW DC)
--2x Shield Drones
-2x Crisis (PR+MP+TA+MT)



How did you get 4 systems on your Elite choice Crisis?
I regret what I have not done.

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Re: 'Ard Boyz Birmingham, AL (again)

Post#8 » Aug 17 2011 04:09

If your worried about your points, don't bother with the FB/TA. DP and FD make flatting out with piranhas worth their points most of the time anyways...you can deal with being stuck having a burst cannon. It's really too bad we can't use R'alai in 'Ard Boyz either, he'd be able to get plenty of kills in vs. Orkz with his blast shots giving no cover.
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Re: 'Ard Boyz Birmingham, AL (again)

Post#9 » Aug 17 2011 04:18

@Crooked
Sorry, typo, the non-team leader suits don't have targeting arrays.

@Commander Blueshock
The FB and TA only save me 30 pts, and really would go a long way to shore up a lower number of broadsides. I'm considering trying out a positional relay/AFB 'el, perhaps accompanying my normal flamer Deathrains. Just add in more templates, at the expense of my second FK bodyguard and perhaps a broadside?
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Re: 'Ard Boyz Birmingham, AL (again)

Post#10 » Aug 17 2011 04:36

Iron-Fist wrote:@Crooked
Sorry, typo, the non-team leader suits don't have targeting arrays.

@Commander Blueshock
The FB and TA only save me 30 pts, and really would go a long way to shore up a lower number of broadsides. I'm considering trying out a positional relay/AFB 'el, perhaps accompanying my normal flamer Deathrains. Just add in more templates, at the expense of my second FK bodyguard and perhaps a broadside?


Yeah but if you knock down the survivability of your XV-8's by giving them flamers in place of the Fireknives, you're going to start having more problems against the typical MEQ army. I wouldn't cut out Fireknive's as they are the most universal suit we have...don't cut yourself short. Swap for a railhead and use it and the fish for walling.
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Re: 'Ard Boyz Birmingham, AL (again)

Post#11 » Aug 17 2011 08:22

@Commander Blueshock
Tru nuff. I may just cut the kroot (they weren't doing enough for me, although I love them dearly) and a broadside (the targeting array squad doesn't need 3), add in another unit of FW and pathfinders w/ fish (markerlights were BALLER in every game), and switch one of the body guards to elite FKs, make one of the shas'els AFP/MP/PosRel. Need to scrounge up one more point for 3 flechette launchers, which would make those devilfish much better at blocking hordes, I think.
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Re: 'Ard Boyz Birmingham, AL (again)

Post#12 » Aug 17 2011 11:23

Aww, you totally should have posted this in the 'Ard Boyz thread I already started.

Oh well. To bad you couldn't turn the green tide into a field of grass, but sounds like you had fun ^_^
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